FL: Blend Fonts & Kerning - What's wrong?

thelring's picture

When I blend 2 fonts the 3rd font is without kerning data/pairs. Why? Do I need to Kern the 3rd font?

Thank you!

thelring's picture

anyone......?

Mark Simonson's picture

I've never used the "blend font" feature, so I don't know the answer. I have used the Multiple Master facility, and I can say that it does make appropriate kerning pairs when generating an instance.

thelring's picture

Thanks Mark!

(so instead of "Blend fonts" - "Build the Multiple Master font", right? well now I need to read about "Name of the axis")

hrant's picture

Anyway, you can always just export the kerning from one of the existing fonts and then import it into the blended one. (Assuming your two source fonts have identical kerning.)

hhp

alan's picture

Does the MM method account for extrapolation? I've never even touched the MM features in FL, after all these years ...

That's one thing I discovered just recently, that FL won't interpolate kerns. Fontographer actually did do this, surprisingly enough, but I think there were some unpredictable results if the two fonts didn't have the exact same pairs defined.

twardoch's picture

In FontLab Studio 5 you will see improvements in kerning handling when working with MM and blending.

Adam

dezcom's picture

>In FontLab Studio 5 you will see improvements in kerning handling when working with MM and blending.<

But when will it come to the Mac? Inquiring minds want to know :-)

ChrisL

Mark Simonson's picture

>That's one thing I discovered just recently, that FL won't interpolate kerns.

It does when you interpolate multiple masters and generate instances.

thelring's picture

I have used the Multiple Master facility, and I can say that it does make appropriate kerning pairs when generating an instance.

OK. This is working. Great. However, I face just one problem: I installed the font, but the font isn't available - mostly with Adobe app., - such as Illustrator, After Effects; I don't have a problem with FCP HD/Live Type, Motion, Freehand. Any idea why?

dezcom's picture

HBM,
I know that thread. You will notice 'twas I who asked the same question there--only to get Adams quip "later". I was hoping for something more definitive, perhaps even something indicative of a calandar fixed point :-)

ChrisL

Mark Simonson's picture

>However, I face just one problem: I installed the font, but the font isn't available - mostly with Adobe app., - such as Illustrator, After Effects; I don't have a problem with FCP HD/Live Type, Motion, Freehand. Any idea why?

From what you have said, I'll assume you are using OS X. You may need to clear your font caches using Font Cache Cleaner or Font Finagler and restarting. Also, what kind of font are you generating?

Mark Simonson's picture

I'm having trouble following your description. Which do you mean:

Kerning works in FCP/Live Type, but not in Illustrator and Freehand,

or...

Kerning works in all of these, but in Illustrator and Freehand it makes the kerned pairs move apart instead,

or...?

In general, I would suggest checking the kerning pairs in the generated "single master" font.

It's also possible, if you've been generating and testing the same font repeatedly, that Illustrator, for example, may be confused because it "remembers" the earlier version of the font.

If this is the case, you can force Illustrator to "forget" about the font by doing this:

1. Quit Illustrator.
2. Uninstall the font.
3. Start Illustrator, then quit Illustrator.
4. Install the font again.

Now when you start Illustrator again, it will treat the font as if was new. If this was what was causing the problem, it should fix it. If you still have the problem, then it's something else.

(As an added measure, you may want to clear your system font caches between steps 2 and 3. I don't think this is absolutely necessary, though it may help.)

Freehand may respond to similar therapy, but I don't currently have it installed, so I haven't tested it and don't know if the diagnosis would even be the same. Could be, though.

thelring's picture

I took my time to try couple things, but I still face the same problem.

When installing the first new font (generated as Type 1, single master) the font didn't show up in the font menu in Illustrator, After Effects. However, with Freehand, Motion, FCP HD/Live Type - the font showed up in the alphabetical order. The day after, the font showed up with all applications, but with Illustrator and After Effects - at the bottom of the list.

By kerning issue/problem I do mean that the letters are too apart with some applications, and with others - not.

After reading your last post I tried a couple of things:

1. I generated another font (Type 1, single master) - this time the font showed up with all applications - in the alphabetical order, but still the kerning issue remains.

2. I generated just "plain" Type 1 (another new font, and not using the Blend mode - MM) and had the same problem as described above.

3. I generated another new font as Open Type(PS), and this time the kerning issue with Illustrator disappeared. Freehand remains with the kerning issue as before. Motion - the kerning working fine. FCP HD/Live Type - the kerning issue remains the same.

In each case I installed the font only one time!!! After facing this problem I didn't remove the font and install it again.
In each case I installed a new different font.

any ideas?

Mark Simonson's picture

I'm still trying to understand your description of the problem.

When you say "letters are too far apart" do you mean that the kerning is not being recognized at all? In other words, it's the same as if you turned kerning off?

Or, do you mean that, with kerning on, the letters are farther apart than the default spacing (i.e., with the kerning turned off)? That with kerning on, the letters move farther apart than with kerning off?

Also, it might help if you could upload some screen snapshots showing how it looks in different applications.

thelring's picture

"When you say "letters are too far apart" do you mean that the kerning is not being recognized at all?"

Yes.


"Also, it might help if you could upload some screen snapshots showing how it looks in different applications."

I'll do it ASAP.

Thanks for your time.

thelring's picture

sample one.....a

thelring's picture

[Mark, thank you for your time. I think that I'm going to "give up" about this issue; since my boss (and his boss) is going to "kern" me to the wall :-) I reported this issue to our tech guys. if the problem is with FontLab we are going to "cut" this softawre; if the problem is with Illustrator, InDesign - the same, etc etc. if our tech guys are going to find something, anything that you and other type designers can learn - i'd love to post it here. Thank you, again!!! ]

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