LITTERAE ANNVAE (no date) Caslon?

jacobsievers's picture

I don't have a date for this document, but does this look like some sort of Caslon?

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oldnick's picture

It appears to match closely the showing of Original Caslon Oldface in Printing Types of the Word...

William Berkson's picture

No, I don't think it's Caslon. It's something more Aldine.

oldnick's picture

I think the running heads and the body copy are two different typefaces; the former may well be Aldine, but the As which appear in the body copy are very Caslonish...

William Berkson's picture

I think the A's aren't wide enough. Also the dots over the i's light and to the right show that it's earlier, I think. Caslon always did his dots heavier and more centered. Also the e is too narrow.

JanekZ's picture

frequentative use of "e caudata" attest it is much older (Frobenius, Garamond, Jannon era IMO)

david h's picture

I think this is Romanee -- van Krimpen

William Berkson's picture

This Litterae Annuae is a record of Jesuits in the 17th and 18th centuries. Van Krimpen is 20th. But Van Krimpen was trying to channel Christophel van Dijck, and this font could be from van Dijck's hand.

david h's picture

Well, he said "no date"; so maybe this is a 'new edition' :)

Mark Simonson's picture

It looks very 16th century to me. Long before Caslon.

Mark Simonson's picture

In fact, it looks a lot like Torrentino of Florence, Italy (c. 1550) (p. 163 of Updike's Printing Types). I'm not definite about this, but I see a strong resemblance with many of the characters.

JanekZ's picture

This one?
http://library.nyu.edu/literature/italian/Italian_Books_Before_1601.pdf
Annuae litterae Societatis Iesv anni M.D.LXXXV. ad patres,
et fratres eiusdem societatis. Jesuits. Romae: in Collegio
eiusdem societatis; 1587. [Reel 11]

William Berkson's picture

Jan, it looks like that one is scanned and on line here and all in Italic!

JanekZ's picture

oops!
Good find, William.
Maybe Annick Delfosse (Université de Liège) can provide any help: http://www.schist.ulg.ac.be/histmod/delfosse.htm

quadibloc's picture

Litterae Annuae Insularum Phillipinarum, dated 1604, by Francesco Vaez, is noted in Google Books, but without a preview (presumably it was not scanned).

There's a slim possibility it might be the book in the picture.

However, it's a letter, and the book has large pages. However, that letter appeared in Relatione Breve by D. de Torres in 1603, so that's another possibility for the book scanned. The title page of that book is visible here:

http://www.christies.com/LotFinder/lot_details.aspx?intObjectID=4548405

Oh, wait: these earlier volumes of the Jesuit annual letters are on Google, and they're not all in italics:

http://books.google.com/books?id=Awc8AAAAcAAJ

so that might be what is sought. (The page headings aren't right, though.)

William Berkson's picture

Jacob, can you tell us where this book comes from? I would think it is from a library or collection, and there would be more information about its title, author, place of publication, which might give a clue as to the date, and narrow down the options on font.

But I think identifying this early stuff is very tricky. For example, there is both a narrow and a wide "n" in your sample. Are they from two different fonts? What David shows above also has both a slanted and horizontal crossbar on the e. Again, two fonts mixed?

Angus R Shamal's picture

Looks like a Garamond to me.

jacobsievers's picture

I am working on getting the information on this book... stay tuned.

jacobsievers's picture

Got it - Published 1604.

At Houghton Library. Full citation:

http://discovery.lib.harvard.edu/?itemid=|library/m/aleph|005836564

You'll have to cut-and-paste the link. (Vertical bars in the URI? What were they thinking...)

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