Troll #2 ;)

wwweye's picture

OK, i repeat: I'm stupid but not lazy...

NOW I can see critical points (of my own) in logo #1 (B2.jpg) and #2 (B1.jpg) and #3 (B3.jpg) and #4 (B5.jpg)
But I'm going to amend that AFTER your crits...

bemerx25's picture

#1 - blah, 1980's-like, with a pacman look-alike attempting to eat the other letters

#2 - Some potential here but not liking the giant "K" - get it back to size and maybe blend it/connect it in like you did with the "S", but be careful to not overdo it.

#3 - K-mart? Uh no. Not working. The "K" just doesn't work with the rest of the letter shapes here.

#4 - too thin, almost disappears - like it has no weight.

#5 - looks like it's a cheap logo for some band's "MySpace" site...

I would suggest further work on your concepts - right now these ideas seem a bit too random and incoherent with little underlying concept behind them.

wwweye's picture

thx, bem
#1 - yeah! (there is a second error: the italic K looks like a drunk pacman ;) )
#2 - amendable
#3 - amendable
#4 - amendable
#5 - just a joke to some guys here in...

wwweye's picture

#2a


.
.

#2b - funny idea, but not really legible...


.
.

#2c

wwweye's picture

#3 - last try with THAT fonts...

wwweye's picture

#4

David Ford's picture

What are some other brands from the industry that you like? What logos from other organisations do you think work well?

wwweye's picture

@david
May I use my telephone joker or ask the audience?

apankrat's picture

> ask the audience?

I think you lost most of the audience long time ago.

bemerx25's picture

#2c. Maybe instead of a red K (reminds me way too much of K-mart), put a red stripe through the letters? Although the K seems a bit too tight/close to the E. Maybe give them a little bit more space while still maintaining the connection.

wwweye's picture

THX bem!
One of the first CONSTRUCTIVE replays...
:)

Lex Kominek's picture

I'd give a constructive reply, but I'm still waiting for you to answer David's question :-)

What logos from other companies (either in the same industry or not) do you think have the right "look and feel" that you are trying to achieve with your logo? What do you want the logo to say about the company?

Strong? Friendly? Established? New and modern? etc. If you can answer this, maybe we can tell you which logo works the best, and what you can do to improve it :-)

- Lex

wwweye's picture

OK

I like...
http://www.film.queensu.ca/CJ3b/Photos/Mexico/VAM83CJ7Ad.JPG
propulsive & unique (cars)

http://www.vastad.at/Data/content/MediaDB/content/kunden_logos/1160083567_9b89nvee99/pic_small?version=1
strong & established (metall industry)

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/de/thumb/4/4a/Hitradio_%C3%963.png/250px-Hitradio_%C3%963.png
very intelligent logo (NOT industry)

http://www.disagroup.com/img/Disa_logo.gif
innovative (metall industry)

http://www.hotfrog.at/Uploads/PressReleases/Neues-Biometrie-Lesemodul-von-Kaba-Benzing-ermoeglicht-breiten-Einsatz-8_thumb.jpg
modern (machines/clocks)

http://phpbb.loercks.net/phpBB/local/bilder/gm.jpg
unique & memorable (cars)
========================================

OK, now...
my client is a 90 year old family enterprise.
They produce FIRST class machines (but NOT high price) with innovative details - but they NEVER communicated theyr USP!
For the last 20 years they were concentrated in developing perfect maschines - but they almost forgot to do marketing at all.
The head of the company is and always was TECHNICIAN not SALESMAN!

enough?

typerror's picture

The nice thing about this site is that there is passion. Sometimes it is heated and sometimes it is laid back but always informative.

Being flip and snotty won't get you anywhere but resented. If you want help... be helpful to those who would love to share their knowledge with you.

Michael

wwweye's picture

And what's my mistake NOW - to get such a remark, typterror?
Last week, OK, i was a bit cynically, sorry!
Then I did my job... and now?

Tonight the marketing chief of KERSTEN is in my house...
Tomorrow I post you HIS decision!

all about seb's picture

www,

now I am just curious as to what you expect him to decide on - until now, you have shown us only one (not so successful, see other thread) concept and a couple of random type experiments in this thread.

What are you hoping to hear from him?

Seb

wwweye's picture

I amended bem's hints...
And IF someone else gives hints & tips... I'll do amendmends again...

But what should I do if there is no more replay?
I must stop - and wait - and answer stupid questions...

THATS THE LAST HINT OF BEM!!!

And now?????
I'm sure for 1000% that tomorrow the next person will appear and f**k ME inclusive my IDEA... (allthough it's NOT MY idea...! Do u understand the REAL problem here? "Too many cooks spoil the broth.")

wwweye's picture

A camel is a horse designed by committee.

Sindre's picture

Tonight the marketing chief of KERSTEN is in my house...
Tomorrow I post you HIS decision!

Whoa! Why don't you bring your father and your big brother as well, so they all can tell us that we've been bad to you?

wwweye's picture

...cause my father died 1983 (I hope your father is still living) and my elder brother died 1959!
As you see I need no help if someone likes to be bad to me... except of my dictionary!

OK!
And what's you GOOD comment (about the logo idea of bemerx25 - who after all seems to be the only person who is really able to communicate)?

wwweye's picture

Oooops, overlooked..

FURTHERMORE LEX ASKED:
> What do you want the logo to say about the company? Strong? Friendly? Established? New and modern? etc. If you can answer this, maybe we can tell you which logo works the best, and what you can do to improve it :-)

INNOVATION (clever assembly of problem solving)
QUALITY (durable, stability, solidity)
WELL-ENGINEERED (experience)

That are my answers...
THX Lex!

picard102's picture

A camel is a horse designed by committee.

This isn't the case here. Seeing as everyone said pretty much the same thing consistently. Now you're getting nothing back from people here because they are tired of trying to help you.

Sindre's picture

I was humourously referring to your comment, that may easily be perceived as quite childish.

[...] seems to be the only person who is really able to communicate

I've gotten loads of very constructive, helpful and friendly advise and criticism on my typeface project here on Typophile after quite recently joining, all very well communicated, and most of them of immense value. After all, many of the members here on Typophile are among the absolute best type and graphical designers in the world.

And what’s you GOOD comment (?)

I'm in no way a logo designer, so I can only give you my opinion based on my non-professional taste: I don't like that joining of the letters, it packs an extreme mass of horizontal weight on the logo, while not communicating anything. That red stripe just emphasises it.

In fact, I think your best suggestion is the one with stencil letters. A non-grungey mechanistic black stencil type could work great. And that cogwheel-thing isn't bad, how about simplifying it (fewer and more distinct teeth), making it a full circle and use it as a little sun above the letters?

evanbrog's picture

how could you have a house when you live under a bridge?
ZING!

i'm sorry nothing against you, i just couldn't resist

bemerx25's picture

Okay I like the stripe. Maybe increase the stripe size a bit? Something like a fat racing stripe that suggests Engineering and Precision (as well as speed I suppose) - but you'll need to find the right balance in the stripe size. Maybe even reverse the colors (gray stripe against red letters)?

Satyagraha's idea is also a possibility - I'd just loose the "grunge" texture if you do go down the stencil-letter route - you want good, clean, industrial engineering and design!

(I'd also suggest that you stop throwing out less than helpful remarks about the community at large. Please exhibit a bit more patience with us, and if it's not too much, a touch of humility - this will go a long way to improving the quality of the responses you're receiving. It also helps to assume people here are helpful and good until proven otherwise.)

wwweye's picture

THX @bem

> "Okay I like the stripe. Maybe increase the stripe size a bit?"
I thought similar...

> "Maybe even reverse the colors (gray stripe against red letters)? "
THX - sounds interesting...

> "(I’d also suggest that you stop throwing out less than helpful remarks about the community at large. Please exhibit a bit more patience with us, and if it’s not too much, a touch of humility - this will go a long way to improving the quality of the responses you’re receiving. It also helps to assume people here are helpful and good until proven otherwise.)"
YES - sorry twice...

(very often I trip over our language barrier)
===================================================

THX @Satyagraha
Sounds good at the beginning... but I have to translate your idea word by word...

> "In fact, I think your best suggestion is the one with stencil letters. A non-grungey mechanistic black stencil type could work great."
I understand...

> "And that cogwheel-thing isn’t bad, how about simplifying it (fewer and more distinct teeth), making it a full circle and use it as a little sun above the letters?"
I thought similar, but I'm afraid of getting a tooo small wheel.
And therefore I tried to construct a mechanical part which looks like a RISING SUN...
As you can see the actual cogwheel is a little bit more then a semicircle (55%)
What do u think about that?
===================================================

SORRY @evanbrog
I understand that this is a joke... but i can't get the meaning.
Sorry, it's easy for me constructing sentences... but I don't understand phrases or metaphers or 'spoken picture' - I AM A AUSLÄNDER, you know? ;)
===================================================

@all
THX very much... I will continue my work! :)

wwweye's picture

NOT POSSIBLE!!!!

The logos he liked:


and

It was a waste of time...
He didn't communicate the last results of the decisions of his company! :(

The new vision is:
- they wanna get rid of the family name... they wanna find a short word which discribes theyr ability.
- they are specialised in constructing by modules (this means they are able to manufacture single machines - individual items - because of theyr developed modules)

SO: Sorry for the first inefficient transition... and for the wasted emotions.

In the meantime I seem to be a relaxed pupil here - so my question:
Do you like to crit the RELAUNCH OF MY OWN LOGO??????

THX :)
Nice weekend

paulstonier's picture

These two examples are a step forward from what you've presented to us before.

However, I'm curious as to what kind of a design education you have, because everything I've seen come from you seems very amateurish.

One thing I see in these is a need to work on getting visual balance and fixing your kerning in some spots.
In your first one, the E and R are too tight and the S and T are just a hair too open.

Second one: the circle is again causing strange spacing of the K from the rest of the letters, at least visually. I would avoid outlining type in most cases. In this case, the S is very distracting because of how close the strokes are together. This makes the letterform look heavier than the rest because optically, the lines blend into one at some point. The letterspacing around the T is again too open. "Maschine…" is too tightly tracked and close to the rest of the wordmark. Brought down in size, you won't be able to read it.

This website is a great reference for education on typography http://www.papress.com/other/thinkingwithtype/index.htm

bemerx25's picture

Thus the importance of only showing clients designs that are really good or that you're willing to live with if they're selected. Better luck next time.

theplatypus's picture

I don't want to be rude. It is not my intention, but I must ask if you have any formal training.

Your diligence is your greatest quality. Hold on to that, however, there are design choices that are not being made here. The foremost is the question, "What are you trying to tell us with this mark?" What I see happening is that you're doing your best to make this look cool and high tech, but there isn't a reason that we can see as to "WHY" you're doing it. Start answering that question as literally as you can, with type or graphics (I push for type) and then expand on it. Pick up a design book from Bob Gill or Paul Rand or Steven Heller. Look to the greats to reach greatness.

best regards,
daniel

EDIT: Just reading the rest of the posts. Your gaining traction! Good luck!

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