Various Versions of Caecilia

idangazit's picture

Hi Folks,

I've fallen in love with PMN Caecilia. It's just a lovely typeface.

It seems like every foundry under the sun sells this face, and I get the feeling that I'm not getting something. Why are Adobe AND Monotype AND Linotype all selling it? Some sell it in small-cap variants with lining numerals, some don't.

I'm a type lover but I'm sadly lacking in typographical history and knowledge of designers, etc. Can somebody please enlighten me as to what's going on here so I can make an informed choice about which foundry I should be buying from, and why?



SuperUltraFabulous's picture

The Linotype version is the one you want.

idangazit's picture

Why? (not rhetorical, I'm asking to learn)

Jan's picture

Should be all the same font. As far as I know Monotype belongs to Linotype and Adobe sells fonts licensed from Linotype.

Ivo's picture

As far as I know Monotype belongs to Linotype
It’s vice-versa: Linotype belongs to Monotype.

Jan's picture

It’s vice-versa: Linotype belongs to Monotype.
Didn’t know far enough then. ;-)

At least the rest seems to be true since Ivo didn’t contradict me there.
He should know. He’s in the glyph-pushing industry.

Ivo's picture

Only the LT guys know all about these relations exactly ;)

But coming back to topic, I also think Linotype’s PMN Caecilia® is the best choice because it’s just the original one.

Bert Vanderveen's picture

Following this reasoning the version that’s on Peter Matthias Noordzij’s computer is the best choice… You could contact him. Maybe he will quote you a special price…

Pardon me for not understanding the difference between a bunch of bits and bytes sold by Linotype and an identical bunch sold by Adobe or Monotype. Though, when I think about it, the icons may be different . In which case I would go for Lintotype — their icons are awesome. (irony intended)

More OT: If I remember correctly at one moment in time Adobe and Linotype made a deal and crosslicenced their fonts (comprising the full extent of their collection at that time). A similar deal exists between Monotype and Adobe. And between Linotype and Monotype.
These deals were amalgamated when Linotype’s type business was bought by Monotype.

. . .
Bert Vanderveen BNO

Florian Hardwig's picture

Well, of course there are differences between the dozens of Caecilia fonts floating around: in terms of format, character set, EULA, support, and price (and, most likely, also the designer’s royalties cut).

And yes, finding out who is offering what can be difficult. For example, states that PMN Caecilia is a ‘Linotype Original’, with ‘Digital data from: Adobe’. Probably those in-house terms do not represent a contradiction themselves, but sometimes things are hard to follow from outside.

you’ll need to find out what version suits you the best: there’s an OpenType Standard version (with smallcaps, old-style figures, and support for most western languages). Then there’s an OT Pro, which additionally has the characters that are necessary for languages like Maltese, Catalan and Gaelic. And there’s even an OT Com, which enables you setting even more languages (Central European languages and Turkish, among them). Or, maybe you are forced to go with a legacy format, due to some software limitation? That’d be a pity, as you’d have to handle multiple font files for smallcaps and osf, let alone for language support.

Jan's picture

Linotype and Monotype versions of fonts are not necessarily identical.
Check the comma and ‘g’ in Utopia for example.

Stephen Coles's picture

I think Adobe did adjust many of the fonts they licensed from Linotype, not just in metrics, but as Jan suggests, in character shapes too. Although in the case of Utopia, it was an Adobe font first, so maybe the adjustments were in reverse in that case.

Idan — Florian has the best answer for you.

idangazit's picture

Hi all,

First -- thank you for the helpful and informative responses. :)

I'm looking for a standard opentype version. I don't really need Cyrillic glyphs and I'd be using the fonts from within Illustrator CS3, so no legacy issues. I would like to have both old-style and lining numerals as well as smallcaps, but not "at any cost".

I guess I need to do some more homework, but you've given me a little more tools with which to dig. Thanks again!


Stephen Coles's picture

You'll want the Std version by Linotype then.

Florian Hardwig's picture

I don’t really need Cyrillic glyphs

Just for the record:
I'm pretty sure that there’s no Cyrillic version of Caecilia, to date. The ‘Central European’ (CE) that most font vendors refer to rather stands for accented Latin characters/diacritics (see CE at MyFonts, for example).

But basically, you’re right of course: Don’t pay for something you have no use for.

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