Class "flyer"...

hrant's picture

Maybe too late for a crit on this one, but if I ever make another batch (like next semester), I'm sure there's room for improvement.

It's a "flyer" I made for posting around the Art Center campus to promote my class. The "g" is from Patria Bold, the text is in Rockwell Extra Bold, and it's been mounted on a foam core base. I've made seven so far (it takes about an hour to make each one... not counting the time it took to make that "g") and I might make two more, but that's it.





Jon Whipple's picture

Hey Hrant,

Is this an example of getting carried away by glyph-love? ;-)

Those are pretty cool. They look neat especially hanging from one another. Yeah I'd say they're worth an hour each.

To my eye the "Art Center at Night • Summer 2005" spreads away from the counter too much at its endpoints. The "Lea..." portion of "Learn..." looks maybe a little too tightly curled and the "...own fonts" not tightly enough.

I can't really tell what's going on with the "m" in "pm". In the drawing it looks sadly scrunched but on the wood background photo it looks fine while in the hangings I'm not too sure. Maybe a redraw of the m? Maybe just move the "Wednesday" to the left more so the "m" doesn't have to turn down?

...and I might make two more, but that's it. suggests maybe no more time is warranted.

Whatever. They're neat.


beejay's picture

Very cool, Hrant!

I've been meaning to ask, When do your classes start?

hrant's picture

> glyph-love?

It's becoming more like glyph-love/hate by now... :-/ I just finished the eighth one, and I might just stop now. But the crits will be useful if/when I do another batch... and next time I'll cough up the dough for something more suitable for the job than my trusty ol' Swiss army knife...

The type-on-path stuff is a bit jumpy, I admit. It was done with Illustrator 7, and by an amateur no less... But I did actually adjust the "pm" manually since making that first "flat" image - so it's better on the actual prints.

One thing I'm wondering about is:
What font would work [even] better than Rockwell Extra Bold?

> I've been meaning to ask, When do your classes start?

And I've been meaning to spam you about it :-) since you're in LA... Registration starts April 11 (enrollment is limited to 12 students), and the first class is on May 18. What's nice is they're giving us two rooms: a spacious one equipped for drafting, and a computer lab too. (BTW, I'll be updating my News entry soon.)


timd's picture

To assist you with cutting it out and g must be the trickiest (btw Swiss Army Knives are only designed to cut out Helvetica), you might want to add a thick stroke to your g for bleed and make a separate layer with a cutter guide in white (or some visible colour) as a hairline stroke and then use a marker to colour in the sides of the polyboard.
I think you have condensed or expanded the Rockwell unevenly, but I don't think you have to replace Rockwell.

hrant's picture

> Swiss Army Knives are only designed to cut out Helvetica

Now that's funny.

As for that dagger, I think it's only good for Demotic.

> add a thick stroke to your g for bleed and make
> a separate layer with a cutter guide in white

Hey, that's a good idea.

But I wanted to leave the relief white, for visibility. BTW, there's black foam board too (which I would have choosen if the flyer were black-on-white instead).

> condensed or expanded the Rockwell unevenly

Yes, especially on the second line; when I scaled the paths to fit the glyph contours better the letterforms were getting squished, and by the time I noticed the necessity of restarting had crossed over my laziness threshold...


Chris Rugen's picture

First off, I think they're great. Especially hanging like that. What a cool display.

"One thing I'm wondering about is:
What font would work [even] better than Rockwell Extra Bold?

With all that curving and knocked-out type, I'd recommend a more open face. One of the neo-grotesque, post-modern sans types. But I'm not a big Rockwell fan, so maybe that's why I think that. Also, with a knockout like that I'd go to a lighter weight, probably the bold.

Did you try a version with all horizontal type? I think the size trade-off would be compensated for by the increased ease-of-reading.

hrant's picture

Glad you like it. It's rare that my graphic design pleases others (ie doesn't suck).

> I'd recommend a more open face.

I agree, but it still needs something quite dark, so people see that there's type, from a distance. One problem is that I don't have that many fonts... Hmmm, maybe I should use Legato? But I don't have the dark weight.

> Did you try a version with all horizontal type?

Where is there room for that?


hrant's picture

I actually didn't try out too many fonts. I recently had a system meltdown (thanks to a virus; but no data was lost, luckily) and I haven't reinstalled too many fonts yet. I'm trying to maintain a lean system (although I know that's always a losing battle). But don't worry, I'm no Vignelli all of a sudden - the gods forbid.

That said, I'm certainly open to specific suggestions.


Chris Rugen's picture

"Where is there room for that? "

Kinda like this (I used Absara, in spite of my earlier recommendations, to preserve the serif on serif thing). This is just a quick sketch.

G-sign horizontal

But now that I look at it, it's more than just a info-hierarchy/legibility trade-off. Yours places the emphasis on the shape of the glyph, which is probably more appropriate and visually interesting, considering the purpose. This is why I used curved type lines on the top and bottom (and the E/402 is just plain better in your version).

Anyway, that's what had in my head when I wrote that.

ebensorkin's picture

RE: the Rockwell. I don't like rockwell all that much either. What about one of the Hoefler Proteus project faces like Saracen?

Something about the serifs seems like it would catch they eye from a distace & relates to your G nicely too

What about reducing the size of some of the letters to allow more space for the title?

This very rough but what do you think? ( Ziggaraut )


ebensorkin's picture

Oh yeah, & put the details 'learn to.. ' & whatever else might be good to have on the other side. Fonts inside of fonts are pretty tricky.

hrant's picture

I think the Proteus idea is great, especially that sharp wedge (AKA "Latin") serif sample you show.

> allow more space for the title?

I like that idea, but in your rough attempt there's no more room left for the rest of the information - and I've already left out a bunch of things they wanted on there, like the instructor's name. :-) BTW, one idea I had was to use both sides of the "g", but then the display requirements would have been huge: I'd need to hang these things, and add "see other side" type stuff too... or hang them in a gentle breeze! Hmmm, the campus is located on the site of a former windtunnel... ;-)

Now I'm getting this vision of a "g" the size of a large SUV* hanging from the ceiling, with a large fan going... And I could like sit on the tail part and swing, reciting famous font quotes... Man, I knew I should've been a performance artist.

* And hey, then I could use that dagger! :-)


ebensorkin's picture

You could put the other info in small too - like the 'art center at night' text.

This is might be touchy but - what if you extend the tail ( the part at the top..) of the g into a circle shaped terminal ( or some other shape) & put the details in that? The bottom of the g might have to be extended too to make it hang straight...

hrant's picture

I think you're right that the size hierarchy could be substantially changed/improved.
BTW, after the course title, the most important thing is the time slot I think.

> what if you extend the tail

Well, then it would be something I wouldn't have made.
Unless somebody paid me, of course.

Plus if I did that you couldn't make a chain. :-)


ebensorkin's picture

Will you post the next one in a year then?

hrant's picture

Next semester, not next year.
Although that's assuming all this works out...

Plus instead of my "g" I think I might use a glyph made by one of my students - we'll see.


sim's picture

Hrant, I think your first idea was a very good one. With some adjustments with the date (reduce the size to avoid to break the smooth line at the end) and the register line (be more in the same curv as the bottom tail of the g). I will keep the good suggestion from Eben how he used the text in the top tail. I'd also suggest to use a sans typeface instead of a serif one for the text inside the g.

Good work.

Miss Tiffany's picture

Kinda fun, Hrant. I would suggest using black-core foam board instead. Did you try a condensed or compressed typeface?

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