Typophile - Typographic checklist... - Comments

Hi Kristina, I tend to set

jason — Thu, 6 Apr 2006 17:50:41 -0700

Hi Kristina,

I tend to set URLs in (non-breaking) italics, and if I had one ending a sentence (which has never come up - almost every instance I’ve run into has the URL enclosed in parentheses) I would, indeed, set it as you have in your example. The main thing if a reader types in the URL exactly as you’ve set it, they’ll get where they want to go. If you include a closing period, they won’t.

ps. I have a handful of copies of the above/ground chapbook if you’d like one. Contact me off-list for details and to say hello.

pps. Sorry for not responding sooner; I was out of commission for the a month and have now been busy making up lost time.

Jason

Hi, Jason: Thanks for

Kristina Drake — Thu, 2 Mar 2006 07:44:32 -0800

Hi,

Jason: Thanks for posting the checklist. It’s always helpful to see how others do things.

I have a couple of questions about urls. I’m on the first of 8 books that are peppered with urls — I’d rather start right than go back and fix things.

I find it odd to remove the http:// when the address is not preceded by www, especially when the address is buried in text. Is this really standard practice? (Guess I’m a little behind on that one.)

When the url appears at the end of a sentence within a paragraph, it seems awkward to not include a period. How do you handle those instances?

From the discussion in this thread I gather this would be the best way of presenting the following sentence:

Pour obtenir plus d’information, visitez notre site Web à l’adresse design.concordia.ca/

Thanks for the help.

Oh, an aside: Jason, I contacted rob mclennan to try and get a copy of your chapbook from him, but he’s all out. He highly recommended your book, so I’ll be looking for it in stores here. If I don’t find it, I’ll order a copy. I’m looking forward to reading it immensely.

Kristina

I’ve added a few things to

jason — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 16:53:19 -0800

I’ve added a few things to be added in more detail to the first page of the list, but I really need to do an overhaul on this thing. For the moment, however, here’s a copy for those who want to take a look. It is, of course & still, a work in progress and only a collection of bits & pieces.

Just received a copy of Mitchell & Wightman’s Book Typography: A Designer’s Manual, a handsomely produced edition that I’m eager to take a close look at in comparison/conjunction with Robert’s Elements. A thorough study will likely result in a few more changes and additions to the list, but here’s the current version for the moment:

Book Typography Checklist (v.5)

I’d like to see this, I

dave bailey — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 12:29:46 -0800

I’d like to see this, I was planning on taking notes as I read through Elements Of Typographic Style and compiling a similar PDF!

I pulled the lists down a

jason — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 12:19:50 -0800

I pulled the lists down a while ago while cleaning up my server directories, as I’d meant to update the list and re-post it, then got side-tracked. I’ll do the update this weekend and get a copy back up here for download. I hope it’s proven and continues to be useful.

Likewise. HTML should be

dtw — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 03:49:31 -0800

Likewise.
HTML should be okay with em— and en– dashes, shouldn’t it?

___________________________________________________
Ever since I chose to block pop-ups, my toaster’s stopped working.

jason, I would like to

mncz — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 02:57:45 -0800

jason, I would like to download your checklist, but the link doesn’t seem to be working. Many thanks to Nick, his file was mighty useful to me:).

…leverage punctuation to

James Arboghast — Wed, 8 Feb 2006 03:18:25 -0800

...leverage punctuation to maximize the visual interest...brisk and exciting

Liberating isn’t it? Adds to your expressive range. I’ve done the same kind of leveraging ever since writing with word processors.

Em dash is dynamic punctuation. It adds movement to a cast of characters dominated by verticality, making it ideal for emphasis or shift of emphasis. In effect you’re throwing the reader’s eye to the right—-with an opening em dash—-and sucking the eye leftwards with a closing em dash. The forward shift works for a solo em dash as well.

j a m e s

Jason, did you finish this

Miss Tiffany — Tue, 7 Feb 2006 13:17:35 -0800

Jason, did you finish this or remove and replace it? Is this available still?

Nice Jason. I got to grips

alphapeta — Fri, 8 Jul 2005 13:36:09 -0700

Nice Jason. I got to grips with most of the content within Mr Bringhurts ’Elements of Typographic Style’ a few years back. I would advise any student wishing to further their knowledge within typography to indulge. It still sits upon my desktop. While I was learning I would try and take something from it every day … and then when time for seminar grouping, I would impress the group with my knowledge of horizontal motion. And I’m being specifically typographic here.

Goudy’s idea (which the

Nick Shinn — Thu, 7 Jul 2005 02:59:34 -0700

Goudy’s idea (which the old guys stole from him) of using an angled hyphen makes a clear distinction between hyphens and dashes.

***

As a writer-typographer, I often leverage punctuation to maximize the visual interest of text. I use the em dash as an alternative to little spotty marks (especially the colon) — it’s so much more brisk and exciting! I also use parentheses as part of this visual scheme: text which incorporates parentheses and dashes, as well as the usual spot marks, is very lively.

So, for an aside, nothing beats parentheses, and then a hearty dash will plunge the reader right back into the main text stream.

***

I also find that in (stacked) bulleted lists, the bullet can be a bit strong, and the period-centered a bit weak, while a dash can provide just the right amount of emphasis. A hyphen always looks like something’s missing.

never mind sheepish grin

grod — Wed, 6 Jul 2005 19:02:37 -0700

never mind *sheepish grin*

l_vazquez While I’m

jason — Tue, 5 Jul 2005 13:50:43 -0700

l_vazquez
While I’m familiar with Dowding’s (and others’) view on dashes, and while I recognize Stephen’s comment about colour & length, my approach to dashes used for asides — like this* — comes down to an editorial perspective.

Dashes used for this purpose are meant to distinguish a secondary comment (the aside) from the primary statement (the sentence). Using an non-spaced em-dash for this purpose really doesn’t make visual sense because such a setting JOINS the two separate components (comment & statement) rather than distinguishing them from one another.

(Granted, a non-spaced em-dash creates physical space between the sentence & the aside, but the glyph itself creates a visual binding that, to me, works against the purpose of the aside as a comment or response to the sentence it resides in.)

The same goes for hair-spaced dashes, whether en or em. While Dowding might say that thin- or word-spaced dashes are left “floating,” to my mind thin-spacing is the best compromise between editorial clarity and typographic colour.

*As always, please excuse HTML’s clumsy handling of dashes in this example. HTML uses em’s rather than en’s, which is what exactly the practice I’m speaking against.

Like it’s been said in

Stephen Coles — Tue, 5 Jul 2005 10:21:21 -0700

Like it’s been said in other threads, I think the long dash situation is largely dependent on the font’s color and dash lengths.

Nice work Jason! Just some

l_vazquez — Tue, 5 Jul 2005 04:23:45 -0700

Nice work Jason!

Just some comments about dashes.

According to Geoffrey Dowding’s ’Finer Points in the Spacing & Arrangement of Type’ en dashes are rightly used in a sequence of figures, as you have done.

For text copy he uses em dashes without spaces between words. He points out that in any case dashes should be separated from the word or words they relate to by a hair space only, otherwise they appear to be floating, making the line of text becoming too gappy.

Typographic checklist...

jason — Sat, 4 Jun 2005 19:31:40 -0700

Hi folks,

As I’m sure is the case with most of you, my notebook is randomly filled with various bugs and hiccups that I try to remind myself to scan for when starting work on a new book. The problem, of course, is that these hints & nudges are spread out all over the place. For a while now I’ve been meaning to compile these notes, and an upcoming wayzgoose has prompted me to put them together either as a chapbook or a series of broadsheets. However, I know that the list I’ve gathered is cursory and incomplete at best, so I wondered if anyone wanted to add their favourite quirks.

This list obviously isn’t absolute, as various spacing and kerning issues will be different from one face to another. The idea was/is simply to put together a list of things to look for with each project.

The list has nothing really to do with layout: that is, I haven’t put in anything about leading or sizing or H&J settings, etc. This is purely about typesetting issues, such as what to place on either side of an en-dash or how to handle singe-quotes inside double-quotes.

Also, at the moment the list is specific to the house-style used at greenboathouse books, a small press I started up a while back. This means many of you will likely have different opinions about many of the setting “rules” I have in the list. Hopefully what I have listed doesn’t make anyone too crazy.

While I’m curious and eager to hear different takes on different bugs, I’m primarily interested in the many details the list is currently missing entirely.

I realize some out there may not be too eager to give away their secrets, so if you’re the quiet type, I understand completely. But for those of you willing to share, please post anything that comes to mind.

At the moment I’ve set the list without much hoopla, designing it primarily with a letterpress setting in mind, so it’s a fairly humble looking PDF at the moment.

While this idea started out as a potential reference tool for my students, really it just seems like a good exercise, and while I was at it I thought some of you might like to stretch your muscles a bit as well.

I look forward to anything you might have to offer...

Here’s the link: A Typographer’s Checklist (so far).

Jason